no shot

[Fisher]

Your Character or Steam Name: Rioda Y. Oungog

Your SteamID: STEAM_0:1:180521832

Your Discord ID#: 302456643545858048

Reason for ban: RDM, 4 POs

Length of ban: 3 days

Reason for appeal (dispute/apology): Dispute

Why should you be unbanned?  A cop walked in with a shotgun, yelled at people to get out of our vehicles as we were doing a demolition derby with like 10 other cars inside the car dealership.  Apparently he had a tazer out too, according to him.  As I was standing outside I saw this and shot him, as this is obviously initiating an arrest.  Im pretty sure what we're doing was illegal, ESPECIALLY because we had just shot a guy in the building like 3 minutes ago for no legal reason.  Also he watched me kill a person for no reason legally so I would've been arrested for several felonies

Additional Information (images, videos, etc): https://medal.tv/games/garrys-mod/clips/iRiGNKV6duzRKZ4_A?invite=cr-MSxYWXgsMjI0MDA3MTk0LA

[Fisher]

Just now, WaffleDevs said:

If you're the cop, could be wrong but the officer admitted in the sit that he was trying to detain people, and the double killing would one hundred percent lead to a felony charge

 

im high lmao this isnt even that

Edited October 11 by Fisher

[GlamourPunk]

this is clearly not rdm, the cop literally saw him accidentally crushing someone with the car. this is such a dumb ban

[Bullets]

Hello! banning admin here, as it shows in your clip the Officer never attempted to taze anyone nor did he say they were under arrest/being detained, he gave a lawful order to step out of the vehicle because your group was having a "Derby" inside the car dealership and you came up behind the Officer and shot him for close to no reason, you claimed in the sit he was placing you guys under arrest but from both clips, I don't see any attempt of arresting any of you he just gave a lawful order.

 

 

https://medal.tv/games/garrys-mod/clips/iRij7TLHtYFO0fGc5?invite=cr-MSxjT1ksLEZPUl9ZT1U

This is the cop's POV

[Z67H]

hey i was the cop in the clip first off i didn't notice you kill anyone i was more focused on the white cars driving in the building and no i did not admit in the sit i was planning to arrest anyone what i said was i was planning to let everyone go since it would of been way to many people to arrest at once with just me i can see why in your perspective why it wasn't RDM since you thought i saw you kill someone 

[Fisher]

1 hour ago, Bullets said:

Hello! banning admin here, as it shows in your clip the Officer never attempted to taze anyone nor did he say they were under arrest/being detained, he gave a lawful order to step out of the vehicle because your group was having a "Derby" inside the car dealership and you came up behind the Officer and shot him for close to no reason, you claimed in the sit he was placing you guys under arrest but from both clips, I don't see any attempt of arresting any of you he just gave a lawful order.

 

 

https://medal.tv/games/garrys-mod/clips/iRij7TLHtYFO0fGc5?invite=cr-MSxjT1ksLEZPUl9ZT1U

This is the cop's POV

What about during the sit when he admitted that he was detaining us?  Regardless of that, still, the rules state that what he did was initiating an arrest/detainment.

https://medal.tv/games/garrys-mod/clips/iRje2wIX97T7OUJRQ?invite=cr-MSxERkYsMjI0MDA3MTk0LA

 

1 hour ago, Z67H said:

hey i was the cop in the clip first off i didn't notice you kill anyone i was more focused on the white cars driving in the building and no i did not admit in the sit i was planning to arrest anyone what i said was i was planning to let everyone go since it would of been way to many people to arrest at once with just me i can see why in your perspective why it wasn't RDM since you thought i saw you kill someone 

This is just you lying. You admitted you were detaining us when you said that.

https://medal.tv/games/garrys-mod/clips/iRje2wIX97T7OUJRQ?invite=cr-MSxERkYsMjI0MDA3MTk0LA

 

1 hour ago, Fisher said:

This is just you lying. You admitted you were detaining us when you said that.

https://medal.tv/games/garrys-mod/clips/iRje2wIX97T7OUJRQ?invite=cr-MSxERkYsMjI0MDA3MTk0LA

I'd also like to point out the short cutting of the clip, as it does not show you walking up and the obvious killing of the guy in the window my clip shows, that you would 100% have seen.

[Z67H]

1 hour ago, Fisher said:

This is just you lying. You admitted you were detaining us when you said that.

https://medal.tv/games/garrys-mod/clips/iRje2wIX97T7OUJRQ?invite=cr-MSxERkYsMjI0MDA3MTk0LA

sorry honestly forgot i said that but still stands that even so you would have to know the names of the people i was detaining in my opinion you should be unbanned because you thought i saw you kill someone (also make sure to be careful if your in a vc and are talking about the game)

 

1 hour ago, Fisher said:

I'd also like to point out the short cutting of the clip, as it does not show you walking up and the obvious killing of the guy in the window my clip shows, that you would 100% have seen.

if i would of seen it wouldn't i have followed you to arrest you?

[Fisher]

Just now, Z67H said:

sorry honestly forgot i said that but still stands that even so you would have to know the names of the people i was detaining in my opinion you should be unbanned because you thought i saw you kill someone (also make sure to be careful if your in a vc and are talking about the game)

Again, we are going over stuff already known from the sit.  Me and you both know that Im in the same faction as all of those people you were detaining, and I had all their F3s.

[Darkfire]

3 hours ago, Bullets said:

Hello! banning admin here, as it shows in your clip the Officer never attempted to taze anyone nor did he say they were under arrest/being detained, he gave a lawful order to step out of the vehicle because your group was having a "Derby" inside the car dealership and you came up behind the Officer and shot him for close to no reason, you claimed in the sit he was placing you guys under arrest but from both clips, I don't see any attempt of arresting any of you he just gave a lawful order.

 

 

https://medal.tv/games/garrys-mod/clips/iRij7TLHtYFO0fGc5?invite=cr-MSxjT1ksLEZPUl9ZT1U

This is the cop's POV

Crazy how the clip was cut to not show what he saw as he came around the corner.... 2min minimum video posting and makes it a 16sec clip hmmmmmm shenanigans I say

This response was sponsored by Familia De Leon.

 

[Fox]

Just want to point something out as I was the staff member who removed all of your cars. What's interesting here is that your defence is 'we were having a demolition derby inside car dealer', which also seems to have been orchestrated through a Discord call?

 

Whilst the RDM is debatable it's clear that you're still minging and potentially metagaming.   Inb4 'everyone was doing it'

Edited October 12 by Fox

[GlamourPunk]

7 hours ago, Fox said:

Just want to point something out as I was the staff member who removed all of your cars. What's interesting here is that your defence is 'we were having a demolition derby inside car dealer', which also seems to have been orchestrated through a Discord call?

 

Whilst the RDM is debatable it's clear that you're still minging and potentially metagaming.   Inb4 'everyone was doing it'

hello, so there’s this magical command called /rumour that was used to advertise a car meet inside dealership 

Edited October 12 by GlamourPunk

[Lucid Mangos]

From another staffs perspective, after having watched both your POV and the cops POV. Penal code 2-3B Vehicular Manslaughter, does not apply to this situation. Could be a potential for 5-2F Felony Improper operation of a motor vehicle. Though I think this would likely fall under penal code 8-4H Reckless Driving. 

Rule number 15 & 16 under killing rules states "

1. In the same vein there are still times when you can't shoot police and it would be considered RDM. You may not KOS Police for no reason. They must be specifically targeting you or a faction member for arrest/takedown. You may not kill Officers for simply pulling you over or writing you a traffic citation. You may not kill Officers for giving you a lawful order. (Leave the area, put that away, Identify yourself, etc)
2. You may attack Officers if they attempt to Arrest/Detain you or a member of your group, knowing that an arrest or detainment would lead to a FELONY charge (Having illegal guns/drugs/etc.) You are PK active after shooting/killing an officer.

" 

At most a lawful order was announced, and then you shot him. The most crucial part of whether it was warranted because of a felony is outrageous, the dude you backed into didnt even die. You see him get up run back in, in both clips.

Sure he did admit in the clip that he was going to detain you guys. But at no point in any of the evidence provided do I believe that this warranted you to shoot the cop. I think the bigger issue is, a lawful order was given, no detainment occurred YET because you killed him. I also think its worth noting that rule 16 states "KNOWING that an arrest or detainment would lead to a felony charge". You did not know. The issue Im seeing a lot of people talking about in this thread is that the cops POV is cut, but you specifically state 3 minutes prior you killed someone. Did the cop witness that? Why wouldnt you include that in the clip if the cop had witnessed that? Again this is just how Im seeing it and breaking it down for whoever in upper administration decides to make the choice.

[Fox]

1 hour ago, GlamourPunk said:

hello, so there’s this magical command called /rumour that was used to advertise a car meet inside dealership 

So that makes it valid RP?

 

So if I made a flying spaceship and used rumour to advertise it, that would be okay?  just because one of you tried to bring it IC doesn't mean it's acceptable. Of all the places on the map to hold a 'car meet', you chose a place in which everybody on the server accesses which is entirely surrounded by walls, it's common sense that you're clearly lacking. As something like this was bound to happen. 

My point still stands, the RDM is debatable but Fisher and the rest of you were still minging. 

[Fisher]

30 minutes ago, Lucid Mangos said:

From another staffs perspective, after having watched both your POV and the cops POV. Penal code 2-3B Vehicular Manslaughter, does not apply to this situation. Could be a potential for 5-2F Felony Improper operation of a motor vehicle. Though I think this would likely fall under penal code 8-4H Reckless Driving. 

Rule number 15 & 16 under killing rules states "

1. In the same vein there are still times when you can't shoot police and it would be considered RDM. You may not KOS Police for no reason. They must be specifically targeting you or a faction member for arrest/takedown. You may not kill Officers for simply pulling you over or writing you a traffic citation. You may not kill Officers for giving you a lawful order. (Leave the area, put that away, Identify yourself, etc)
2. You may attack Officers if they attempt to Arrest/Detain you or a member of your group, knowing that an arrest or detainment would lead to a FELONY charge (Having illegal guns/drugs/etc.) You are PK active after shooting/killing an officer.

" 

At most a lawful order was announced, and then you shot him. The most crucial part of whether it was warranted because of a felony is outrageous, the dude you backed into didnt even die. You see him get up run back in, in both clips.

Sure he did admit in the clip that he was going to detain you guys. But at no point in any of the evidence provided do I believe that this warranted you to shoot the cop. I think the bigger issue is, a lawful order was given, no detainment occurred YET because you killed him. I also think its worth noting that rule 16 states "KNOWING that an arrest or detainment would lead to a felony charge". You did not know. The issue Im seeing a lot of people talking about in this thread is that the cops POV is cut, but you specifically state 3 minutes prior you killed someone. Did the cop witness that? Why wouldnt you include that in the clip if the cop had witnessed that? Again this is just how Im seeing it and breaking it down for whoever in upper administration decides to make the choice.

During the sit the officer straight up said he was detaining us, not that he was gonna, that he was detaining us.  Already we've established that the majority of the people in that room who would've been arrested are my faction members, and we were blowing up cars and shot a guy earlier, realistically that enough has us covered on the felony standpoint but also consider the fact that we all are in cars so several would've been hit with felony evasion.

The fourth example of what is considered an attempt to arrest or detain someone is almost exactly what he did, pulling a shotgun out and ordering everyone out of the cars seems very much like that.

https://medal.tv/games/garrys-mod/clips/iRje2wIX97T7OUJRQ?invite=cr-MSxERkYsMjI0MDA3MTk0LA

However, obviously i'm gonna agree that this whole situation was just mingey, theres literally no way around that but I think the situation was properly handled by js deleting the cars

[Bullets]

4 minutes ago, Fisher said:

Using this as an example when the clip clearly shows him with a tazer NOT firing it and out ordering the group of people to step out of the vehicle.

The words "You are being detained" or "You are under arrest" weren't spoken on the scene only after when he was in the sit room, he gave a lawful order for you guys to stop driving, for example; A Police Officer flicks on his sirens, and asks you to stop driving does that give you right to plow him down with a gun?

[Fisher]

20 minutes ago, Bullets said:

Using this as an example when the clip clearly shows him with a tazer NOT firing it and out ordering the group of people to step out of the vehicle.

The words "You are being detained" or "You are under arrest" weren't spoken on the scene only after when he was in the sit room, he gave a lawful order for you guys to stop driving, for example; A Police Officer flicks on his sirens, and asks you to stop driving does that give you right to plow him down with a gun?

What? He very clearly had a shotgun out and was ordering people to get out of the cars, and he admitted what he was doing was detainment in the sit?  How is him straight up admitting he was detaining us not enough for it to be detaining us?  What he said in the sit should have been more than enough for you to just let me go.

Also, "for example; A Police Officer flicks on his sirens, and asks you to stop driving does that give you right to plow him down with a gun?" is just not at all the same as the situation that went down, a regular traffic stop is not the same as people getting ran over and shot and hit

Edited October 12 by Fisher

[Lucid Mangos]

44 minutes ago, Fisher said:

What? He very clearly had a shotgun out and was ordering people to get out of the cars, and he admitted what he was doing was detainment in the sit?  How is him straight up admitting he was detaining us not enough for it to be detaining us?  What he said in the sit should have been more than enough for you to just let me go.

Also, "for example; A Police Officer flicks on his sirens, and asks you to stop driving does that give you right to plow him down with a gun?" is just not at all the same as the situation that went down, a regular traffic stop is not the same as people getting ran over and shot and hit

You have it backwards chief, the officer arrived to attempt detainment. The detainment was not successful bc you blew his brains out. Go and google the definition of detainment and tell me what it says. I guarantee you the definition states that you are in custody of a law enforcement officer, not at any point was anyone detained appropriately, they were still just driving around or running around all willy nilly. Again, the charges are the most important part, even if the detainment/arrest was made.

[adam]

From the clips provided, no attempts at all were made to arrest/detain anyone on the scene at all. The cop stated his intent to arrest/detain in an admin sit after the situation had already ended. His plan may of been to arrest/detain people, however you killed him before he initiated either one. Only a lawful order was given, which you may not kill for. Given your 20 notes and 19 bans, you should consider yourself extremely lucky on the length of this ban. By now, you should know the rules inside out and be trying your best to avoid situations like this.

[adam]

Your ban appeal has been reviewed and denied.

We have determined this ban to be reasonable and/or justified.

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