01-13-2023, 02:12 PM
(This post was last modified: 01-13-2023, 02:14 PM by Canadian-bacon. Edited 2 times in total.)
You nearly missed the window.
I want to be clear that while it's both normal and natural to seek other people's opinion just because they may support a singular version of events that you provide doesn't necessarily make the opinion correct or objective. The PK rules are there as a guideline of the basic requirements or outline for possible PKs but each individual situation is unique, so it's up to the discretion of the Administrator to determine a reasons validity, never had someone want his cock and balls back.
So as for the PK I basically interrogated the man for half an hour and determined that his reasoning was valid, that he was able to identify you and that there was no OOC malice.
The official PK reasoning in technicality is: "Causing significant / tangible physical harm, Accusations of being a rat and possible hit / murder being placed"
So as you mentioned in the appeal you cut off his cock, balls and a finger in roleplay, this does ultimately count as harm as it's within roleplay (Of which i had complimented you on) and accused him of being a rat, something for which he maintained innocence of, both in your conversation, my sit with him and the conversation in the backroom before the PK. As you also admit you had put in a 'dons orders pk' and through conversations with you he obviously inferred that his life was a risk, this also counts as another possible reason (circumstantial) if the user can provide proof or suspicion that they may be murdered (usually this is couple'd with other valid reasons as it was here). I later confirmed that you had written a don's order for his PK and you admitted that you deleted it, though you claimed the reason for that at the time was because no one in your faction replied to you, leading you to believe it may not have been supported or approved by your High Command.
A few other things to get through here, obviously shooting someone in the chest as 'punishment' is an odd thing to do when attempting to refute the claim of repeated harm
Concerning the point that you refer to regarding a '15 minute rule' and how it was '2 days later' I don't see how that is relevant. You caused lasting physical harm, no rule states you are exempt from consequences of your actions after 15 minutes. The rule you directly quoted A) Refers specifically to 'If you are the one acting in defense of the PK victim' which wasn't the case or circumstance and B) in the same rule you quoted "you will need to seek approval from an Admin like a regular PK request" which is something he did.
Only 4 other rules mention 15 minutes and none invalidate your PK, they are as follows:
- When you carry out a PK you are pk active 15 minutes after killing the person
- Initiating a shootout or violent confrontation with Police can lead to a PK. Killing or attacking an Officer after initiating a violent confrontation leaves you PK active from officers for about 15 minutes
- You MUST follow NLR after every death. You will not remember anything from the last 15 minutes before your last death in RP
- You may mug one person / singular group of people every 15 minutes. Mugging again immediately, before allowing the timer to expire will be considered Mass Mugging. Realistically you must lay low after mugging someone.
None of these apply here and a person is always able to make a PK request on someone to retaliate within a reasonable timeframe. I think you were confused on the rule as the situation calls for a PK request and NOT a retroactive PK. Had he killed you then attempted to pk you retroactively it would have been denied.
To address the three times you mentioned the word 'repeated' in big bold and italics, as i said the rules are there as base guidelines to follow, PK's are a list of checkboxes that need to be validated before one can be approved, one of those checkboxes as it states in the same line, "there has to be tangible damages". You said it yourself here, you caused both a SIGNIFICANT and TANGIBLE damage. The rule is worded such a way because people would get into something like a fist fight and ask for a PK or theyd have a small item stolen and ask for a PK so the if/or requirement was placed where either the damage to you has to be tangible (expensive good was stolen, serious harm caused) OR it had to be repeated (robbed several times, beaten up several times), and of the course the handling Administrator would determine if one or both of the conditions were met in the request. Cutting someones cock off is tangible, unfortunately.
From the perspective of the individual; in his eyes he was. 1) Accused of something he didn't do. 2) Maintained his innocence and requested mercy. 3) Was punished regardless and lost a finger, cock and balls for it. (Argument regarding extreme workplace punishment to be had) 4) And was then under the belief that he would be murdered based on the conversations that followed. I'd imagine if you were in a similar position and requested a PK as a means of retaliation or pre-emptive protection and were denied because of "well he needs to repeatedly cut your dick off" that it would frustrating.
Losing a finger not being a big deal would just invalidate your own rp for no reason. What's the point of the punishment if it's not a big deal. I enjoy the Sanzensekai punishment roleplay as it provides more depth to their faction, but you also didn't just cut off his finger, you cut this man's cock off. "none of it has to be taken to heart it's all IC" It's roleplay, it's the only sensical time to take it to heart. Obviously I can't speak on his behaviour in OOC afterwards but that doesn't invalidate a reasoning usually.
Just like in our long discussion afterwards I compliment your roleplay and urge you to continue, it was simply the end of your character's story, and a good way to go out in the end. Cutting men's dicks off.
I want to be clear that while it's both normal and natural to seek other people's opinion just because they may support a singular version of events that you provide doesn't necessarily make the opinion correct or objective. The PK rules are there as a guideline of the basic requirements or outline for possible PKs but each individual situation is unique, so it's up to the discretion of the Administrator to determine a reasons validity, never had someone want his cock and balls back.
So as for the PK I basically interrogated the man for half an hour and determined that his reasoning was valid, that he was able to identify you and that there was no OOC malice.
The official PK reasoning in technicality is: "Causing significant / tangible physical harm, Accusations of being a rat and possible hit / murder being placed"
So as you mentioned in the appeal you cut off his cock, balls and a finger in roleplay, this does ultimately count as harm as it's within roleplay (Of which i had complimented you on) and accused him of being a rat, something for which he maintained innocence of, both in your conversation, my sit with him and the conversation in the backroom before the PK. As you also admit you had put in a 'dons orders pk' and through conversations with you he obviously inferred that his life was a risk, this also counts as another possible reason (circumstantial) if the user can provide proof or suspicion that they may be murdered (usually this is couple'd with other valid reasons as it was here). I later confirmed that you had written a don's order for his PK and you admitted that you deleted it, though you claimed the reason for that at the time was because no one in your faction replied to you, leading you to believe it may not have been supported or approved by your High Command.
A few other things to get through here, obviously shooting someone in the chest as 'punishment' is an odd thing to do when attempting to refute the claim of repeated harm
Concerning the point that you refer to regarding a '15 minute rule' and how it was '2 days later' I don't see how that is relevant. You caused lasting physical harm, no rule states you are exempt from consequences of your actions after 15 minutes. The rule you directly quoted A) Refers specifically to 'If you are the one acting in defense of the PK victim' which wasn't the case or circumstance and B) in the same rule you quoted "you will need to seek approval from an Admin like a regular PK request" which is something he did.
Only 4 other rules mention 15 minutes and none invalidate your PK, they are as follows:
- When you carry out a PK you are pk active 15 minutes after killing the person
- Initiating a shootout or violent confrontation with Police can lead to a PK. Killing or attacking an Officer after initiating a violent confrontation leaves you PK active from officers for about 15 minutes
- You MUST follow NLR after every death. You will not remember anything from the last 15 minutes before your last death in RP
- You may mug one person / singular group of people every 15 minutes. Mugging again immediately, before allowing the timer to expire will be considered Mass Mugging. Realistically you must lay low after mugging someone.
None of these apply here and a person is always able to make a PK request on someone to retaliate within a reasonable timeframe. I think you were confused on the rule as the situation calls for a PK request and NOT a retroactive PK. Had he killed you then attempted to pk you retroactively it would have been denied.
To address the three times you mentioned the word 'repeated' in big bold and italics, as i said the rules are there as base guidelines to follow, PK's are a list of checkboxes that need to be validated before one can be approved, one of those checkboxes as it states in the same line, "there has to be tangible damages". You said it yourself here, you caused both a SIGNIFICANT and TANGIBLE damage. The rule is worded such a way because people would get into something like a fist fight and ask for a PK or theyd have a small item stolen and ask for a PK so the if/or requirement was placed where either the damage to you has to be tangible (expensive good was stolen, serious harm caused) OR it had to be repeated (robbed several times, beaten up several times), and of the course the handling Administrator would determine if one or both of the conditions were met in the request. Cutting someones cock off is tangible, unfortunately.
From the perspective of the individual; in his eyes he was. 1) Accused of something he didn't do. 2) Maintained his innocence and requested mercy. 3) Was punished regardless and lost a finger, cock and balls for it. (Argument regarding extreme workplace punishment to be had) 4) And was then under the belief that he would be murdered based on the conversations that followed. I'd imagine if you were in a similar position and requested a PK as a means of retaliation or pre-emptive protection and were denied because of "well he needs to repeatedly cut your dick off" that it would frustrating.
Losing a finger not being a big deal would just invalidate your own rp for no reason. What's the point of the punishment if it's not a big deal. I enjoy the Sanzensekai punishment roleplay as it provides more depth to their faction, but you also didn't just cut off his finger, you cut this man's cock off. "none of it has to be taken to heart it's all IC" It's roleplay, it's the only sensical time to take it to heart. Obviously I can't speak on his behaviour in OOC afterwards but that doesn't invalidate a reasoning usually.
Just like in our long discussion afterwards I compliment your roleplay and urge you to continue, it was simply the end of your character's story, and a good way to go out in the end. Cutting men's dicks off.